Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 22:19:22 +0200 From: Michele Moglia To: "AEgyptian-L@rostau.org.uk" , GlyphStudy@yahoogroups.com Subject: AEL GlyphStudy: ~8 - Prepositions, prepositional nisbes and prepositional adverbs - Some questions Studying Allen's Chapter 8 about prepositions I tried to make a table with prepositions and their adverbial and nisbe forms, but Allen's rules and examples left me some holes and questions. Can someone help me to fill holes and solve questions ? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | | Prepositions | Adverbs | Nisbes | | | | | masculine | feminine | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- |1 |imitw |imitw-ni | |? | |2 |in | | | | |3 |m |im |imi |? | |4 |mi |my (=mii) |miti |mit | |5 |mm |mm | |? | |6 |n |ni |ni |? | |7 |r / ir |iri |iri |? | |8 |HA |? |HA(i) |? | |9 |Hna |Hnaw |Hna(i) |? | |10 |Hr |not used |Hri |? | |11 |xft |xftw |xfti |? | |12 |xnt |xntw |xnti |? | |13 |xr |not used |xr(i) |? | |14 |xt |not used | |? | |15 |Xr |Xri |Xri |? | |16 |tp |not used |tpi |? | |17 |Dr |Dr | |? | ------------------------------------------------------------------------- RULES by Allen's text Prepositional adverbs (page 03) = add a -i or -w ending Prepositional nisbes (page 89) = add an -i ending (masculine) or -t ending (feminine) NOTES by Allen's text 1) The adverbial form imitw-ni is actually a compund form of initw and the adverbial form ni 2) in is not really a preposition QUESTIONS by me a) preposition m seems not to follow ending rules, is there some explanation ? b) prepositional nisbe of mi adds an -ti ending, why ? c) what about adverbial form of HA ? e) what is feminine syntax of prepositional nisbe ? Thanks in advance Michele Moglia ============================================================================== From: To: "Ancient Egyptian Language List" Subject: AEL ALLEN GLYPHSTUDY 23.11 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 21:00:42 -0500 23.11 rSwj Dddj n.f nn "How joyful is he, to whom this has been said!" Vocabulary: rS (adj); happy, joyful Dd (verb 2-lit): to say, to tell nn (neuter demonstrative pronoun): this For rSwy, see Allen 7.2. This is the dual form of the adjective used in exclamatory sentences with adjectival predicates: "How joyful (is X)! Dddj is the perfect passive participle of the verb 'Dd'. Usually, the perfect passive participle ends in -w, but 2-lit geminate verbs are an exception (Allen 23.5.5). An English translation could be 'has been spoken','has been said'. A literal translation, following the Egyptian word order, could be "How joyful (is he), said to him this" Rearranging the words to get it half-way to English could be: "How joyful (is he), this said to him". Or a little closer yet: "How joyful (is he), this having been said to him." 23.11 transliteration: rSwj Dddj n.f nn translation: How delighted is he to whom this is said This is a sentence with an adjectival predicate. The adjective serving as the predicate is 'rSwj' which is a masculine active perfective participle of the 3ae-inf. verb 'rSj' meaning "delight, rejoice". The dual form is used for emphasis. The subject of the sentence is the participial clause 'Dddj n.f nn'. This starts off with 'Dddj' which is the masculine singular geminated perfective passive participle of the 2-lit. verb 'Dd'. Here the action of this passive participle is not performed on the (unexpressed) antecedent; rather, the object of the participle's action is here expressed by the demonstrative pronoun 'nn' ("this") following the participle (see sec. 23.15 starting at paragraph 4). Preceding 'nn' in the participial clause is the dative 'n.f' ("to him", the dative precedes the object 'nn' since it involves a pronoun). The suffix pronoun 'f' refers back to the (unexpressed in the Egyptian here) antecedent ("he"). Thus, the participial phrase means "(he) to whom this is said" where the dative is translated "to whom" connecting it with the (unexpressed in the Egyptian here) antecedent "he". 23.11 TRANSLITERATION: rSwj Dddy n.f nn TRANSLATION: "How delightful is this which was said to him." NOTES: rSj, rSw = 3ai = "delight, rejoice" rS = adjective = "delightful", rSwj is an emphatic dual "twice delightful" Dd = 2lit = "say", geminated perfective passive Dddy n.f nn = adjectival sentence, paradigm nfr Hmt tn "This woman is beautiful" (7.2). In this instance literally: "what was said to him is this". As a nominal, the phrase is in apposition to rSwj. ============================================================================== From: To: "Ancient Egyptian Language List" Subject: AEL ALLEN GLYPHSTUDY COLLATION 23.10 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 21:00:02 -0500 23.10 wADwj jr nA n nTr.f "How fortunate the one who did that for his god!" wADwj - masculine dual perfective active participle of the 3-lit. verb wAD "blue-green, fresh, fortunate" jr - prefective active participle (I think) of the 3ae-inf. verb jrj "do" nA - demonstrative pronoun "that" n - preposition "of, for" nTr.f - noun "god" with possessive 3MS suffix pronoun Section 23.11 describes using the masculine dual perfective active participle in an adjectival predicate as an exclamation. wADwj means literally "one who is fortunate (twice)" or "doubly fortunate". Such exclamations are translated with "how ... is ..." so we have "How fortunate is..." If "doubly fortunate" is the predicate of an adjectival sentence, the subject must be the rest. The participle of jr, if active and perfect means "one who did". The object of the participle is nA. Allen translates this as "this", but chapter 5 describes the -A demonstratives as contrasting to the -n series, so I chose "that". It might be clear from context. The doing is clarified (by and adverbial?) prepositional phrase n nTr.f "for his god". Putting it together we have "Double fortunate is one who did that for his god." 23.10 wADwj jr nA n nTr.f nTr - god nTr.f - his god wADw - green, blue-green, fresh, 'fortunate' wADwj - how fortunate (7.2) jr - no special ending, so perfective active participle jr - the doing one, the one who has done/is doing, the doer jr nA - the one who has done this jr nA n - the one who has done this for finally: How fortunate is the one who has done this for his god 23.10 wADwj jr nA n nTr.f wAD - adj 'green, blue-green, fresh, fortunate' . Here, the old masculine dual form is used in a exclamatory adjectival sentence (§7.2) jr - verb ' to do'. Here, perfective active participle nA - this n - 'for' nTr.f - his god Here 'jr nA n nTr.f' form a single subject of the sentence - 'he who has done it for his god' SO: How fortunate is he, who has done it for his god! ============================================================================== From: To: "Ancient Egyptian Language List" Subject: AEL ALLEN GLYPHSTUDY COLLATION 23.12 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 21:01:11 -0500 23.12 [hA]b Tw Hm.j r jrt nn sjA.n Hm.j wnt nn jrt(j).f st nb Hr xw.k "My Incarnation sends you to do this because my Incarnation has recognized that there is none who will do it except you." Vocabulary: hAb (verb 3-lit): to send, to send word sjA (verb 3-lit): to recognize jrj (verb 3-weak): to do, to make Note: I'm wishy-washy on the grammar of the second half of the sentence; I'll be interested in seeing some of the other interpretations. hAb Tw Hm.j - "My Incarnation sends you (2ms)" r jrt nn - "to do this" The infinitive after 'r' expresses purpose (14.11.3) -------------------------------------------------------- The rest of the sentence seems to be an adverbial clause; it gives the reason or circumstances because of which the sending took place. sjA.n Hm.j - perfect; "(because) my Incarnation recognized" wnt - I'm taking this to be the proclitic particle "that"; see Allen 16.6.6. It marks the following clause as a noun clause; "(because) my Incarnation recognized THAT ....." jrt(j).f - Allen reveals in the Key that jrt(j) is in fact a prospective particle. Like all prospective particles, it ends in '-tj' and is followed by a suffix pronoun. I believe that it is being used as a noun here; "the one who will do (it)" nn jrt(j) - see Allen 11.4. I'm taking this 'nn' to negate the existence of "someone who will do it"; in other words, there is NO ONE who will do it. As Allen says in 11.4, this could be a "nn A" negation of existence with an adverb or prepositional phrase attached. There's an interesting use of the adjective 'nb' here. When it follows a participle, it can have the meaning 'at all',or 'any'. "There is not ANY who will do it'" (Allen 23.9, end) Hr xw.k - set phrase, "except for you". 23.12 [A] hAb Tw Hm.j r jrt nn [B] sjA.n Hm.j wnt nn jrt(j).f st nb Hr xw.k [A] hAb - send hAb Tw - sends you hAb Tw Hm.j - my incarnation sends you hAb Tw Hm.j r jrt - my incarnation sends you (in order) to do hAb Tw Hm.j r jrt nn - my incarnation sends you to do this [B] sjA - recognise, vb 3-lit sjA.n - has recognised - perfect sjA.n Hm.j - my incarnation has recognised sjA.n Hm.j wnt - my incarnation has recognised (there) to be/is sjA.n Hm.j wnt nn - my incarnation has recognised there not to be ... nn jrtj.f - ... not to be one who will do (prospective participle) ... nn jrtj.f st nb - ... not to be any one who will do it = none who will do it ... nn jrtj.f st nb Hr xw.k - ... none who will do it except you [A] [B] - [A] because/while/when/etc [B] finally: my incarnation sends you to do this because my incarnation has recognized that there is none who will do it except you 23.12 hAb Tw Hm.j r jrt nn sjA.n Hm.j wnt nn jrt(j).f st nb Hr xw.k hAb = verb 3-lit = send hAb = imperfective = sends/is sending Tw = dependent pronoun 2ms = you Hm.j = my Incarnation hAb Tw Hm.j = My Incarnation is sending you r = preposition = to jrj = verb 3ae-inf = do, make jrt = infinitive = to do nn = demonstrative pronoun = this r jrt nn = to do this sjA = verb 3-lit = recognise sjA.n = perfect = had recognised Hm.j = my Incarnation sjA.n Hm.j = My Incarnation had recognised the perfect used in an adverb clause (18.11) denotes prior circumstances therefore sjA.n Hm.j = because My Incarnation had/has recognised wnn = verb 2ae-gem = exist wnt = sDmt.f form = there was nn = negation jrj = verb 3ae-inf = do, make jrt(j).f = prospective participle = one who will/would do it st = dependent pronoun = it, they, them nb = any nn jrt(j).f st nb = not anyone (no-one) who will/would do it Hr xw = prepositional phrase (dictionary) = except Hr xw.k = except you hAb Tw Hm.j r jrt nn sjA.n Hm.j wnt nn jrt(j).f st nb Hr xw.k = My Incarnation is sending you to do this because My Incarnation recognized (that) there was no-one who would do it except you NB: I have been struggling with all the different grammar - if it is a load of rubbish, will someone please tell me! ============================================================================== From: To: "Ancient Egyptian Language List" Subject: AEL ALLEN GLYPHSTUDY COLLATION 23.8 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 20:45:25 -0500 23.8 Allen hint: not a complete sentence Transliteration: m.Tn nj ddw n.sn pA aqw m st nbt Dissection: 1) m.Tn = "look, behold", 2PL particle (16.6.7) 2) nj = negation 3) ddw = imperfective passive participcle of "put, give" 4) n.sn = "to them" 5) pA = demonstrative pronoun "those" 6) aqw = "rations, salary" 7) m st nbt = "anywhere" (lit. "in any place") Translation: (literal) Look, there are not those given to them rations in any place. Paraphrase: Look, that salary is not given to anyone anywhere. Questions: Allen includes "such" in his answer translation: "such rations," but I am hard pressed to find a word corresponding to that. Is the paraphrase I give a correct interpretation of the clause? 23.8 m.Tn nj ddw n.sn pA aqw m st nbt Look there are not those to whom such rations are given anywhere. m.Tn = "look", particle nj = "not", for nn, introduces nn A adverbial sentence ddw = "given", imperfective passive participle n.sn = "to them", prepositional phrase pA aqw = "such rations", m st nbt = "in any place", This sentence begins with two particles, m.Tn, "look", and a negative particle that is written nj. Allen tells us to read this second particle as nn. The particle nn is the beginning of a nn A sentence construction, where A is the participle phrase ddw n.sn pA aqw. The form of the participle ddw indicates that it is imperfective and probably passive (active dd(j)w). This is an example of the special use of the passive participle where The action is not being performed on the antecedent (§23.15). Here there is no expressed antecedent, but there is still a pronoun, sn, in the participle phrase that agrees with the gender and number of the participle (c.f. 5th and 6th examples on p.336). So ddw n.sn is literally "those who given to them", that is "those to whom are given".. What is given is pA aqw. Following Allen's suggested translation of pA, this is "such rations" or "such a salary". The use of a singular demonstrative suggests that aqw is a collective noun. Faulkner, for example, does not record a singular form. The sentence is concluded with the prepositional phrase m st nbt, "in any place"; or more succinctly "anywhere". ============================================================================== From: To: "Ancient Egyptian Language List" Subject: AEL ALLEN GLYPHSTUDY COLLATION 23.13 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 21:01:50 -0500 23.13 transliteration: jr jrtj.f nn Ddwy.j wnn.j m zA snb.f m mktj n Xrd(w).f translation: Concerning the one who will do this which I say, I will continually be a safeguard of his health and protector of his children. This sentence starts off with the prepositional phrase 'jr jrtj.f nn Ddwy.j'. The preposition is 'jr' which is the form of 'r' usually used when the preposition begins a sentence. The object of the preposition is the participial clause 'jrtj.f nn Ddwy.j'. 'jrtj.f' is a prospective participle of the 3ae-inf. verb 'jrj' ("make, do"). It is formed from the base stem with the ending 'tj' attached. The 3MS suffix pronoun 'f' specifies the gender (masculine) and number (singular) of the agent of the action. This basically participle means "(one) who will do". The participle has an object given by 'nn Ddwy.j'. 'nn' is a demonstrative pronoun ("this"). This is modified by 'Ddwy.j' which involves Allen informs us means "which I say" The rest of the sentence is the clause 'wnn.j m zA snb.f m mktj n Xrdw.f'. This starts off with the imperfective of the 2ae-gem. verb 'wnn'. The 1S suffix pronoun 'j' attached to 'wnn' is the subject ("I") of the clause. 'wnn.j' is followed by two prepositional phrases. The imperfective of 'wnn' followed by a prepositional phrase is used to express a situation that is habitual, incomplete, or ongoing. The first prepositional phrase is 'm zA snb.f'. Here the preposition 'm' has the meaning of "in" the capacity or identity of something. The object of the preposition is the phrase 'zA snb.f' where 'zA' ("protection, safeguard") has the direct genitive 'snb.f' ("his health"). 'wnn.j m zA snb.f' thus means "I will be a safeguard of his health". The second prepositional phrase is 'm mktj n Xrdw.f'. In this phrase, the preposition 'm' plays the same role as in the previous one. The object of the preposition is the noun phrase 'mktj n Xrdw.f' where the noun 'mktj' ("protector") is followed by the indirect genitive 'n Xrdw.f'. The genitival adjective 'n' agrees in number (singular) and gender (masculine) with 'mktj'; note that 'n' is here written using the S3 Red Crown (alternative for N35 starting in the 13th dynasty, common in the New Kingdom). ' 'Xrdw.f' means "his children". 'wnn.j m mktj n Xrdw.f' thus means "I will be protector of his children". 23.13 TRANSLITERATION jr jrty.f(j) nn Ddwj.j wnn.j m zA snb.f m mktj hrdw.f ALLEN dDwj.j "which I say" TRANSLATION "As for he who will do this what I say, I will be one who is a safeguard of his health and a protector of his children." VOCABULARY zA noun, m - "protection, safeguard" mktj noun, m "protector" GRAMMAR jr introduces if clause jrty.fj prospective participle, masc sing nn object of jrty.fj dDwj.j relative clause, appositive to nn wnn.j prospective sDm.f m zA snb.f m of acquired status, the status being expressed by zA. zA snb.f is a direct genitive construction. m mktj hrdw.f again, m of acquired status, mktj is the status. mktj hrdw.f is a direct genitive. ============================================================================== From: To: "Ancient Egyptian Language List" Subject: AEL ALLEN GLYPHSTUDY COLLATION 23.9 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 20:59:33 -0500 23.9 aAm Xz wn Hr Dd jnk nb the vile Asiatic who was saying: "I am the lord" aAm = "Asiatic" Xz = "vile" wn = "who was", perfective active participle Hr Dd = "saying", pseudo-verbal predicate jnk = "I", 1s independent pronoun nb = "the lord" This is a fragment of a sentence. It starts with the subject aAm Xz, "the vile Asiatic". (Xz is an adjective frequently applied to foreign enemies.) The next three words are wn Hr Dd. Here Hr Dd looks like a pseudo-verbal construction. The preceding wn is a participle allowing the pseudo-verbal construction to function as a participle (§23.17). wn is a perfective active participle. This phrase means "who was saying", and introduces direct speech. The remainder of this exercise is the word of the Asiatic: jnk nb. This is an A B nominal sentence with an independent pronoun as A (§7.7). It means "I am the lord". *********************************************************** 23.9 Transliteration: aAm Xz wn Hr Dd jnk nb Dissection: 1) aAm = "Asiatic" 2) Xz = from Xzj (adj.-verb 3ae-inf) "wretched, vile, miserable" QUESTION: (Would this be a perfective active participle?) 3) aAm Xz = "The wretched Asiatic" 4) wn = perfective active particple (23.17) 5) Hr Dd = "was saying" 6) wn Hr Dd = "who was saying" 7) jnk nb = "'I am the lord'" (independent 1S pronoun, nb="lord") nonverbal clause Translation: "The vile Asiatic, who was saying 'I am the lord'" ============================================================================== From: To: "Ancient Egyptian Language List" Subject: AEL ALLEN GLYPHSTUDY 23.14 Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 21:02:18 -0500 23.14 wnn.k Hr rdjt dj.tw n.f aqw, nn rdjt rx.f ntt ntk rdj n.f st "You shall be giving that rations are given to him, not giving that he knows you are the one who gave it to him." wnn.k - prospective of the 2ae-gem. verb wnn "be, exist" with 2MS suffix pronoun as subject Hr - preposition "upon" rdjt - infinitive of the anom. verb rdj "give" The prospective of wnn is used to give a prospective aspect to an adverbial phrase or stative, in this case Hr rdjt "upon giving." (Note, the answer key points at section 21.17 here, which does not exist. Question: The prospective of wnn is discussed in section 21.7. Mark-Jan Nederhof's corrections page suggests section 20.17 as the intended reference, which is the *imperfective* of wnn, which can function similarly to apply the imperfect aspect to an adverb or adverbial phrase (but not the stative). I suppose that works equally well, with the giving being regular or continuing instead of in the future. I'm not sure how one would distinguish. Perhaps imperfective is more likely because the next phrase is imperfective?) dj.tw - imperfective of rdj with passive suffix pronoun (All other likely forms are spelled with r, or don't take a suffix pronoun as subject.) n.f - dative "to him" aqw - noun "rations" So this forms an unmarked relative clause meaning "rations are being given to him". Putting that together with the previous clause, "You shall be giving (that) rations are given to him." Or, if it's really the imperfective of wnn, "You are giving (that) rations are given to him." nn - negative particle rdjt - infinitive of rdj again rx.f - imperfective of the verb rx "know" with 3MS suffix pronoun as subject "it is not giving (that) he knows" ntt - relative adjective, feminine form ntk - 2MS independent pronoun rdj - perfective active participle of rdj n.f - dative "to him" st - 3MS dependent pronoun as object of the participle "that which you are the one one who gave it to him" Putting it together we have, "You shall be giving (that) rations are given to him, it is not giving (that) he knows that which you are the one who gave it to him." Simplifying, "You shall be giving that rations are given to him, not giving that he knows you are the one who gave it to him." Allen's translation in the key, "You shall be giving that rations are given to him, not giving that he knows you are the one who gave it to him," avoids the peculiarity of the Egyptian use of rdj for "let, permit, make happen" and so on, but I find it hard to follow. 23.14 Transliteration wnn.k Hr rdjt dj.tw n.f aqw, nn rdjt rx.f ntt ntk rdj n.f st Dissection: 1) wnn.k = (20.17) imperfective of wnn + 2MS suffix pronoun; signifies on-going state/action 2) Hr rdjt = Hr+infinitive (14.11.1) signifies concomitant action 3) dj.tw = passive construction 4) n.f = "to him" 5) aqw = "rations/salary" 6) nn = negation (14.15.1) 7) rdjt = infinitive, "causing" 7a) nn rdjt = "without causing" 8) rx.f = "his knowing" (infinitive) 9) ntt = "that" noun clause marker 10) ntk = 2MS independent pronoun 11) rdj = perfective active participle (per Allen) 12) n.f = "to him" 13) st = "it" 3N dependent pronoun ("it, they, them") Translation: Literal Breakdown: wnn.k Hr rdjt dj.tw n.f aqw = "You shall be causing rations to be given to him..." nn rdjt rx.f = "...without causing his knowning..." ntt ntk rdj n.f st = "that it is you who has given to him." 23.14 wnn.k Hr rdjt dj.tw n.f aqw nn rdjt rx.f ntt ntk rdj n.f st wnn.k - prospective active 'you will be', allows the following to function as a prospective Hr + inf - concomitant action (§14.11.1) rdj + subj. has a causative meaning dj.tw - passive subjunctive ' one will be given' n.f - to him aqw - rations, salary nn - negation rx - to know rdjt rx.f - causing him to know (rdj + inf again) ntt - relative adjective 'that, which exists' ntk - you (2MS independent pronoun) rdj - perfective active participle n.f to him st - it SO: You will be causing rations being given to him without letting him know that it is you [who are] giving it to him. Not at all sure about grammar :( but this was my best shot. ==============================================================================